Some of you may have seen Peggy Fletcher Stack’s article in the Salt Lake Tribune that per guidance of the North America West Area Presidency, via the instruction of Area Seventies and Stake Presidencies, local Relief Society and other women leaders have been abruptly asked to no longer sit on the stand during sacrament meeting in wards where they had been. In response, I’ve written a letter to the area presidency, which I’m sharing below (although I’ve not blogged here at the Exponent for a long time). The mandate disappoints me. I hope that the reporting and response from people can open a conversation about more inclusivity and elevating, rather than diminishing, the role of women within the church. Amy Jensen, who is quoted in the article, is collecting letters to send to the Area President. If you would like to send a letter expressing your feelings on this matter, please send it to [email protected]
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To the North America West Area Presidency of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints—Elder Bragg, Elder Sabin, and Elder Ojediran; and to all Area Seventies, General Authorities, and church leaders otherwise invested,
In general conference, the sea of suits is striking. They are usually black and blue. Sometimes they are fitted and sometimes they are baggy. They are worn by generally well-meaning men who are trying to honor the priesthood. You may look at this sea with reverence and respect, which I do to a certain extent, but have you ever considered what it feels like for a woman to not see herself amongst the suits and leadership of the church? However, when the cameras pan the conference center, you occasionally do see a spark of color coming from the women leaders of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Their presence on the stand is meaningful to the women who are also looking to follow Christ and lead in the capacities they are given. My question to you is this: Why can we not have a visual representation of the women leaders on the stand in our weekly Sacrament meeting as well? Or better said, why was it taken away?
As a Bay Area native, I have witnessed women sitting on the stand alongside the bishopric and speakers for years in a number of wards and stakes that I’ve been in or visited—to the extent I don’t remember the first time I saw one nor really thought about it being different. To me, it was a beautiful reminder of the role these women played in ministering to others. They were not claiming any authority beyond their callings, nor boasting of their presence, but rather humbling serving their wards. From what I have observed, the practice became wider spread as independent bishops and wards thought about how they could better serve their members. And having women sit on the stand was meaningful to the individuals and to the ward. Maybe it should have been talked about more so it wasn’t seen as an anomaly to the broader church.
When you saw or heard of the practice, why did you rush to stomp it out as one of the first things you did as a new area presidency? What was the problem with their presence? How could you not see women sitting on the stand honoring their leadership positions as beautiful or inclusive? That it gave these women a “bird’s eye view of their congregations.” That the women were still sustaining and supporting the bishopric members and priesthood. Instead of saying this needs to stop, why did you not take it up to Salt Lake, and say hey look, a bunch of wards and stakes are trying to include women in services in different ways, and maybe we should consider suggesting it as an option for the church as a whole?
And why, when you decided to issue the mandate, why did you do so without explanation, offering it only as a directive—leaving it to Peggy Fletcher Stack of the Salt Lake Tribune to try to flush out a response from a church spokesman about aligning to the general pattern of worship?
I don’t expect you to answer my questions. But I want you to recognize the anger, sadness, and disappointment that this change and its implementation has caused even if the women have heeded the instructions. That women have felt diminished as a consequence of the mandate.
And I would like to humbly ask you rather than diminish the role of women within the church, what can you do to elevate them within the structure of the church? And how can you communicate with women directly so they are not blindsided when changes are made?
I would love to see a conversation open up about inclusion as a product of this unfortunate change even if sitting on the stand during Sacrament meeting is still deemed not appropriate (although I would like you to reconsider that). The women of the New Testament were important converts and leaders of the early church as I believe women in our church should be—but unfortunately they are under-appreciated and under-utilized in building the kingdom of God.
With all respect and faith,
Sariah Anne Lanier Kell, Berkeley 1st Ward, Oakland California Stake
(but known here on the Exponent blog as Kelly Ann)
28 Responses
I first heard about this a couple of weeks ago on LDS Changemakers Instagram. Then Cynthia and Susan of At Last She Said It mentioned it on a podcast. Cynthia said something along the lines of all the important things in the world that need healing, a general authority is willing to die on the hill of who is sitting on the stand. This is a very general paraphrase of what she said; it captures the sentiment though. Referencing Knives Out movie, kicking women off the stand is stoopid with two Os.
I hope the letter writing campaign goes well. Even more I hope that the leaders who read this will have enough empathy to comprehend the point you try to make in the letter.
Extremely well written, so respectful and eloquent yet strong voice in explaining what is wrong with what occurred! I heard about this in the At Last She Said It Podcast.
So sad that this type of action occurred and I hope your letter and those of others yield results.
Thank you for writing this.
Sarah,
Here is the link
This was an episode of listener voice-mails, it is at approximately 25 min 55 sec mark where it begins!
They also had a good discussion on the Facebook page!
I am relatively new and don’t comment much so hope it is ok to provide the link.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/22J8U42UwkcVdAVqvRXrak?si=vIHMsjcVTf63PjM7cw17aA
Awesome, thank you so much
Thank you Bailey and Nita. I will look up the At Last She Said Podcast. I’m not actually sure that this letter writing campaign will bring about any change but I feel like it’s very important for our voices and experiences to be heard.
You are welcome! It is a fantastic podcast in which 2 women share all those things that they are finally able to say, concerning church and patriarchy, and all those things that impact women perso. In the last few months, they have started adding listener comments at the very end. basically, it is where people can record themselves saying something, and they just add that as a voice message at the end, so in one of the recent episodes, one of the ladies who listened that area, shared what happened. I just got home but I will try to find that episode in a minute to share with you.
Yes, I’m excited to listen to all topics with them. Sounds very much like an interesting format.
And as a note, for reference, since it didn’t get added to my post. The picture/ thumbnail is a Plaque of the First Relief Society by Elaine Brockbank Evans which is on the mantle of the fireplace in the Relief Society room of the Berkeley Ward Building. Elaine was a long time member of the Berkeley ward and her art is in both church buildings and the visitor center.
I wrote a letter and sent it along! I’ve requested that the female leadership sit on the stand for ward and stake conferences before and been denied. That a ward has been doing this practice for ten years on regular Sundays is a miracle to me. I thought I was pretty well armored and could weather these instances of pain inflicted by leadership, but this one does cut fairly deep. I hope the letters will be received with the intent of their sending – that hearts can be opened.
I am exmo now, but this incident makes me almost want to submit a letter that says, “Thank you for validating my decision to leave. Thank you for bringing to light all the struggles I faced behind closed doors in ward councils and bishop interviews.” I won’t do that, but I do feel very seen whenever the leaders are cruel and/or sexist on the public stage. It brings such relief, because confiding my church struggles with fellow members usually results in them telling me that I” must have remembered it wrong. ” These news stories validate my experience. Thank you for sharing
Every time something like this comes out I start drafting a letter to my old bishop in my head, “I would yet again like to resign from TCOJCOLDS” Such a shame one can only resign once.
@Beelee Thank you for writing a letter. It’s been longer than ten years. I even remember it in a YSA ward at BYU maybe. But it’s definitely been more so lately, although not universal by any means, in a number of stakes in the Bay Area. So it’s a big loss. And in terms of armor, what I’ve learned over time, is that it’s almost guaranteed there will be something new that will hurt. But the hurt has tempered as I’ve accepted the church is imperfect.
@Sariah That is incredible! Over 10 years and across a whole geographic area! The more I learn about this situation, I’m understanding just what is lost by the misguided actions of these men. A lot of times, I can take the woundings in stride and soldier on. This one is something to sit with, to feel deeply, and to process over a long time. It feels important to witness fully what is being done.
@EmilyB I’ve felt that way before. To hear something and think I’ve distanced myself… But I’m currently feeling pulled back (which is a story I should tell later) and thus very much feel compelled to speak up. If I’m going to become active again (which note I don’t think is the path for everybody), I’m bringing everything to the table. I’m sorry to hear people within the church did not understand your experience. I do feel lucky to be in a really diverse community here where people in the ward reflect it and accept everybody as a church family.
You can send letters to the General YW Presidency by emailing: [email protected]. All letters are appreciated and read by the Gen YW Presidency. Our ward is one of the ones that women are no longer allowed to sit on the stand. I think it is important that leadership can hear all the women (and men) this is impacting.
If they keep up these power-play shenanigans these leaders might soon find themselves all alone on the stand, presiding over an empty room.
The bishopric sit on the stand to conduct the meeting. The Elders quorum and RS presidency don’t because they have no responsibility for that. As a woman I don’t find that offensive at all. Spend your time with some noble cause.
It may not look like it here but I think this is the majority view. I’m a bit dismayed how few readers here are even considering the Lord’s will and presume that the leaders of His church should be following letter writers rather following Him whose church this is.
I’m not saying I have an inside track on the Lord’s will, but I’m saying that the Prophets do, and other leaders do for their callings and under the leaders they follow.
I think it’s far safer and far more accurate to presume that the guidance from our leaders is the Lord’s will.
The Lord listens to member activism, as evidenced by the way the revelation about Black men holding priesthood came about AFTER members made their voices heard.
At DMc, to the credit of those I know impacted, the women are listening to the guidance and not sitting on the stand. But to say one should not express how they feel in response, I don’t think is appropriate. Even if nothing results from the letters, it’s important to know the leaders had a chance to hear from the people impacted. We’re not talking a radical action in response.
at DMc – oh, that’s awful to think of sitting on the stand as the Lord’s will. Jesus has nothing better to do than dictate a seating chart?
When I was RS Pres, I sat on the stand about once a month because only a few women in the ward actually came to Relief Society. Some left after sacrament meeting but most had callings in Young Women and Primary. I could actually see who was there and make eye contact, instead of trying to get someone’s attention through the back of their head.
The women in California were not “invading” the men’s space or acting outside their callings by sitting on the stand. This is a ridiculous decree from a man who, for some reason, decided this was a good way to throw his weight around. It is not.
It’s almost as if they don’t care if people leave.
I think this is another good example of how isolated these old men are from the members. Seriously, how could they not see that removing women leaders from the stand would be their next PR disaster. It’s like they have the reverse Midas touch.
At Dave, I agree with this. I think one of the hardest things about this is that there was no conversation or even presentation about it. Like they didn’t think it would be a big deal. I’m tired of hearing responses from press releases after an article comes to light rather than things being presented upfront.
Thank you Kelly Ann! I live in Los Altos Stake —the same as Relief Society President Laura McNeil who was on the podcast with Amy Jensen. It was excellent. I will add my letter. I have already sent an email to our Stake President. The whole thing was so condescending..the announcement was made followed by an outpouring of love and gratitude for the women in the church.
This was the same week that the horrific war in the Middle East broke out…yet this was the important message from the pulpit that we needed to hear as members of Christ’s church? I think not ….I believe Christ would have asked us to pray for peace and be mindful of our brothers and sisters in both Gaza and Israel. Such a big deal made out of such a trivial thing —women on the stand —-yet to us women It rightfully meant a lot because of what it symbolized. We have been too patient in dealing with patriarchy. And still ..this is where we stand ..or rather can’t stand..pun intended.
This appears to be nothing more than pride to me. In all the congregations I’ve been in, those on the stand are those who have responsibility for the meeting and those participating in the meeting. It’s not a place to show how important you are. We are taught that it doesn’t matter where you serve, but how you serve. Are they somehow more important than the janitor, or a primary teacher?
One lesson I learned while serving in primary presidency is that often there are reasons for change that are not always obvious or appropriate to explain. We had to implement a change in our primary that made a lot of people angry. If they knew the reason behind our decision to make the change then I think people would have been more understanding. But it wasn’t appropriate for us to share that information. I’m grateful I had this experience several years ago because it has opened my eyes to the fact that the general authorities of the church (both male and female) have so many issues they are working with. Sometimes decisions are made based on what they feel is best even though they are not always at liberty to explain.
I look at this with very different eyes. My husband began ‘sitting on the stand’ the Sunday after we adopted our oldest child. For the next 6 years he watched me struggle with our active children and growing family. On a couple of occasions he got up and left the stand to give me some help. Ward members saw these few times he came down from the stand as family first. After waiting so many years for a baby, I felt sorry for him having to sit in the stand and so very grateful it wasn’t me. I felt blessed by Heavenly Father that I was able to sit with my children. As years passed and my family grew he served in more ‘sit in the stand callings’. We have always felt sorry for him ‘being required’ by calling to sit on the stand. Even as I became an empty nester, I still don’t understand the issue concerning women on the stand. I feel like making it an issue is teaching the wrong message. It is making ‘the stand’ to be viewed as a powerful
status issue. It seems to have the message that somehow, people who sit on the stand are more important than those in the congregation. That simply is not true. Who suffers if a dad is in the bishopric and a mom is president of an organization? Who sits with their children? Is that really the position we want to take? I can see some of your points for it… but it feels like you have not considered reasons it could become a burden on family, just to make women feel important and seen. Truly, I am of the opinion that putting women on the stand weekly in sacrament meeting sends 2 messages I disagree with. One is that being seen on the stand and having a leadership calling makes a person more important than the members of the ward. That is not true. Secondly, it sends the message that stand sitting is more important than children and family. That is also not true. Sitting as a member of the congregation is the most important and worshipful place to sit. Sitting with family is a privilege.